regulatory quackture

I was going to vote Green in the Euros, but I don’t like the look of this at all:

The Green Party will set up within legislation the practice of patient empowerment, with the right of individuals who are to receive treatment to have full and detailed knowledge as to their condition and the range of treatments available, both conventional and complementary/alternative

…and this:

oppose attempts to regulate complementary medicine, except by licensing and review boards made up of representatives of their respective alternative health care fields.

 

…and this:

encourage the development of a wider and more relevant range of research techniques, including methods appropriate to the assessment of complementary therapies.

So the Green NHS is going to promote quack remedies, let quacks regulate themselves and change research procedures so that eye of fucking newt comes out good as solpadeine. It’s full scale regulatory quackture.

I know, the Greens…but I thought vaguely that the people who believed that stuff had all died off or something. Anyway, back in your box, crusties. You’re not ready for prime time just yet.

Comments

[Chris Williams]

Shite innit? OTOH, the way things are going, I'm on the point of joining the Greens precisely because given that they are the only game in town, someone's got to de-woo them.

I've been leterboxing their flyers for a different reason: D'Hondt means that in the E Mids, moving them up past the BNP is the only hope we've got of keeping the fash away from the trough. I think it's the same in the North West.

[jamie]

"I'm on the point of joining the Greens precisely because given that they are the only game in town, someone's got to de-woo them."

You're right, it's just that I'm not the joining kind. It's real reality check stuff though. Shame really, I was enjoying the post-Labour browsing. The missus, who's a straight down the line traditional labour voter, sent off her postal vote for NO2EU because she saw the PPB and liked what it had to say. She said it was just like getting something from QVC. I tell you, the greens have got a lot to learn.

I thought the point with voting in the Euros was to push the BNP below a certain percentage of the vote, which means you can do that whoever you vote for.

Ho hum. Lib Dems again...

[Cian]

The way Caroline Lucas screwed over Keith Taylor for the Brighton seat gave me serious pause.

[ejh]

Ho hum. Lib Dems again...

Anybody who helps Sharon Bowles back into the European Parliament puts their immortal soul in peril.

Just saying.

[Phil]

Can't see much wrong with Ms Bowles - I mean, she's welcomed the adoption of recommendations concerning new rules which will help to close loopholes on the taxation of savings income in the form of interest payments, as indeed who wouldn't? All I can get from her Web presence is that she's deeply smug and rather dull. Do you know her in the real world?

[ejh]

Yes, she's my stepmother.

[Phil]

That puts things in a whole new light.

[ejh]

Some things, but not others.

[Alex]

Regarding the Greens, the fact that such a small party has managed to give me two elected representatives as arse-awful as Jenny "give the cops what they want, for eco-feminism - anyway, how dare you send me e-mail" Jones and Caroline "ships are sort of big and rivetty, aren't they, let's abolish them" Lucas suggests it still contains nuts.

No2EU, meanwhile, pisses me off. Is that what the left is reduced to? Bob Crow and George Galloway in a Kilroy-suit?

So, yup, looks like I'm voting Lib Dem. Perhaps I'll vote Labour locally to support Jeremy Corbyn.

[BruceK]

I will still vote Green, but I agree with you entirely about this.

Self-regulation? Surely we've seen where that leads...

[punkscience]

The Greens may have a dick-awful healthcare policy. I rail against it- and the persisting tree-hugging-fuckwit element sporadically. Eg. Councillor Philip Booth and his petition against enforced vaccination.

http://punkscientist.blogspot.com/2008/12/what-fuck.html

However, politics is a pragmatic game. On balance- and despite their other bizarre policies such as 20mph urban speed limits and their ridiculously authoritarian gun policies- they are clearly the best option on the table. The Lib Dems 2005 manifesto didn't mention carbon emissions once. Their policies are generally ever-so-slightly more progressive versions of the Tories and Labour. This is not what is needed in this country. We need sweeping political change and the installation of just, ethical and- above all- forward looking government.

I did write to Caroline Lucas about Philip Booth and requested that she direct him to dissociate his anti-scientific bullshit from his political persona. I had a fairly rewarding exchange with one of her staffers (obviously not Caroline herself) over the issue and got the impression that they're not worried about this sort of fluffy crap because as soon as they are in power the British Medical Association and the rest fo the scientific establishment (of which I am a part) will simply refuse to endorse such fluffy goat-wank and will slap the hair-shirted element down with stout blows from the Knobbly Beating Stick of Rationality.

I am eternally frustrated that a movement (environmentalism) that was originally galvanised by the revelations of modern environmental science is still being hijacked by the qi-channeling, chakra-chanting crystal-lickers. I fucking hate hippies.

[Cian]

Justine: The wicked stepmother is top of the LibDem list I'm afraid. Barring electoral meltdown, she's in. I can't see myself voting LibDem, as they don't seem to stand for much more than tactical electoral stuff these days.

For the Greens while Caroline Lucas is top (who I instinctively distrust, though I'm not sure why), the next two are Keith Taylor (who's okay - good local councillor in Brighton) and Derek Wall (eco-marxist).

Cian

[Cian]

Chris,
I've been thinking of either joining the greens (Tendence: Derick Wall), or the Labour party post-meltdown. The latter might be a once in a lifetime opportunity to help push Labour back somewhere sensible. Not a fun thing to do, but possibly worthwhile. Having never actually joined a political party (personal tendence: Ken Macleod), I'm not sure how much influence one could actually have as a local activist.

[Richard J]

People I know who've met her speak highly of Caroline Lucas, but whenever I read her letters/etc. in the press, I just can't help but shake the feeling that there's an edge of arrogant certainty to her that's almost, well, Thatcher-esque...

[Cian]

"Despite their other bizarre policies such as 20mph urban speed limits"

Hardly bizarre. Just because you don't agree with it, doesn't make it bizarre. Its simply expressing different priorities to yours. Personally, I think a default 20mph speed limit would be fantastic. I'd probably take it further and knee cap speeding drivers, but I'm carrying some anger from being nearly hit by idiot macho drivers. Being a pedestrian should not be an extreme sport.

Cian

[Cian]

Richard,
she certainly came across that way in the Brighton campaign. The fact she styles herself doctor also bothers me more than it probably should. It seems to be claiming an authorative highground that a doctorate in English doesn't really give one outside the English department...

[Richard J]

English? I'd always, don't know why, assumed it was medicine or science...

[Richard J]

qv. Dr Fox, PhD in Marketing.

[Cian]

"I'd always, don't know why, assumed it was medicine or science..."

Exactly.

[jamie]

"The fact she styles herself doctor also bothers me more than it probably should. "

Yes: a very bad sign. She might as well just go round weaing a white coat plugging shampoo.

[ejh]

The wicked stepmother is top of the LibDem list I'm afraid. Barring electoral meltdown, she's in.

Oh, I know. I suppose at least this time she'll actually be elected rather than get her seat despite not being elected.

Actually she's only personally wicked, politically it's no more than the usual LibDemmery (e.g. against financial regulation last year, a champion of financial regulation this year and so on).

[Dan Hardie]

'Dr Fox, PhD in Marketing.'

Eh? The Tory politician Liam Fox, if you're referring to him, is an MD - studied at Glasgow and worked as a GP.

Certainly this doesn't stop him from being a particularly credulous nutter, attracted to neo-con ideology in the same way that small children in war zones like to pick up brightly-coloured cluster bombs, but even so- start checking your facts.

[Richard J]

Dan> Sorry, much less highbrow, Dr Fox, the popular music DJ, m'lud...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/tv_and_radio/3301347.stm

[dsquared]

I assumed you meant Neil Fox, but even so I am not sure he does have a PhD in marketing.

[Richard J]

I cite as evidence for his doctorate a passing comment in a piece of Gonzo-style reportage in the NME c. 1998-1999 (possibly on figuring out why people were still buying What's The Story, Morning Glory?) - he happened to be at a press launch for something else, and the NME journo rudely asked him what his doctorate was in.

It's startling what bits of random trivia stick in the mind at times.

[punkscience]

"The fact she styles herself doctor also bothers me more than it probably should. "

"The fact she styles herself doctor also bothers me more than it probably should. It seems to be claiming an authorative highground that a doctorate in English doesn't really give one outside the English department..."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Yeah, cos getting a PhD clearly means you're a dishonest, corrupt cunt, right?

"Just because you don't agree with it, doesn't make it bizarre."
~~~~~~~~~~~
". . . but I'm carrying some anger from being nearly hit by idiot macho drivers."

So, clearly no axe to grind there.

Has anyone here actually read the GP's manifesto? Or any other party's?

IMHO you should before making generic statements about party policy.

[Phil]

getting a PhD clearly means you're a dishonest, corrupt cunt, right?

Er, no. But a doctorate in arts & social sciences areas generally isn't seen as conferring any authority more broadly, which is why it's not usual for people who have them to use the title outside the academic context. That's why I don't use mine, anyway.

(And the GP's science policy contains rather too much woo for my liking - but I'll probably vote for 'em today anyway.)

[ajay]

I think it's just a good rule of thumb to be very suspicious of anyone in politics who calls themselves "Doctor". Dr Paisley, Dr Goebbels, Dr Karadzic...

[Chris Williams]

I avoid using mine not because of an inferiority complex about social sciences (for such it is - last History Phd in Social Sciences Sheffield will ever award, I imagine), but in order to avoid the remote possibility of an air stewardess saying to me "It says Doctor on your passport - you've got to help me try to resuscitate this man."

I'm off to do the dirty Green deed. Anyway, punkscientist, what's wrong per se with nuclear power? Boy, has it got its downsides, but are they necessarily worse than those of the other base load solutions (or restucturing the economy so we don't need base load)?

[Dan Hardie]

There was a DJ called Dr Fox when I was an undergraduate: is he still going? My God, the conservatism of popular entertainment.

Casting my mind back, I just assumed he called himself 'Doctor' as in (puts on bad Barry White voice) 'Ah'm Doctor Luuurve, and this heah is mah clinic'.

[Chris Williams]

I used to have an office next to that of "Dr DJ Power". Signs are deceptive; he was (and indeed is) a thoroughly nice inoffensive medieval historian, not a toon-spinning crack-munching bling-sporting nightclub dude.

[ajay]

I am fairly certain, however, that Dr Dre does not in fact have any postgraduate qualifications.

[dsquared]

I'd always wondered why Eminem was so keen to boast that his albums were produced by a Doctor of Religious Education.

[Phil]

I don't know, Chris. There's something self-cancelling about Dr DJ Power; it's a bit Father Ted somehow. Reminds me of the time the Indie printed a letter from Trafford Lovething, headed in the usual style

From: Mr Trafford Lovething

(Googling tells me that he's changed his name by deed poll and hence actually is Mr Trafford Lovething. Stroll on.)

[Chris Williams]

And I have it on good authority that Spock's PhD was actually a postmodern analysis of Romulan literature. He kept that one quiet.

[ajay]

"If your child is crying, it is because he is cowardly and weak."

[dsquared]

As I understand it, Spock was a medical doctor, but called himself Mr Spock because he'd taken the Vulcan equivalent of the FRCS.

[ajay]

Similarly, Doctor Slaughter is a centre-left international relations theorist in the US*, and not, as her name would suggest, a professional wrestler.
Both Dr Slaughter and Dr Power** are now helping to run US foreign policy.

*Anne-Marie Slaughter, AB, MPhil, JD, DPhil, former Professor of Politics and International Affairs at Princeton University.
** A different one: Samantha Power, BA, JD, Professor of Practice of Global Leadership and Public Policy at Harvard's John F. Kennedy School of Government.

[Richard J]

This is reminding me of the Viz comic strip involving "not strictly speaking a real doctor per se" Gillian MacKeith.

(The latest issue, BTW, has a Karl Marx/Engels double act, and also a strip that relies on being aware of Jonathan Swift's Modest Proposal)

[Dan Hardie]

All you need to know about the intellectual rigour of Blairism, and its contempt for cheap novelty: the first research director of Demos changed his name to Perri 6. Not Six, 6.

He used to be Dr 6, due to his PhD in Sociology (I make no comment; my restraint is saintly) and he is now, of course, Professor 6.

[McGazz]

I dunno - a bit of "smell to get well" on the NHS is hardly an outright rejection of Modernity (plus, jars of water cost nothing, and the placebo effect is a powerful thing). Surely the fact that the Greens are clued up on climate change suggests they know a *bit* about science?

Better than voting Lib Dem, which is basically voting Labour/Tory (depending on where you live) but not having the balls to admit it.

[ejh]

I used to see this girl who was studying for her PhD: I tried to interest her in the concept of changing her name to Pussycat if she got it, so that they would be obliged to put Doctor Pussycat on her office door.

(I believe she got the qualification, but alas retained her old name.)

[jamie]

"Surely the fact that the Greens are clued up on climate change suggests they know a *bit* about science? "

That's the wider problem. More than anyone else the Greens are a science based party, so it's pretty horrific that they're proposing to debauch research standards. The Lib dems? A place to park your vote till soething better shows up. A sort of vote cattery.

[Alex]

The Britain of British politics. You flee there when everywhere else has gone. There seems to be a major water barrier between them and the barbarians, and presumably someone's patrolling it.

[Cian]

I think there are quite a few on the greens who believe in climate change for romantic reasons, rather than scientific ones.

[Cian]

Yeah, cos getting a PhD clearly means you're a dishonest, corrupt cunt, right?

I guess I'll find out when I hand in my thesis.

So, clearly no axe to grind there.

Well yes, that was rather heavily implied in what I wrote. Was the comment about "knee-capping" too subtle for you?

[Richard J]

Norman Cohn's
The Pursuit of the Millennium is always helpful in understanding the roots of certain elements of greenery. (And socialism. And libertarianism. And the ackier born-again Christians. etc. etc.)

[punkscience]

Cian, apologies for my tone. Drunk posting is fun but no excuse. I've finally got a firm hand-in date for my thesis (ecotoxicology BTW) so I'll come back here at the end of August and tell you how good it feels. :~

[Cian]

That's okay, we've all done it at some point. Incidentally, I wouldn't have a problem with her using Dr if she had a PhD in ecotoxicology.